| kingpilot06 |
hi all,
i have a problem in my 2006 pilot lx. i just installed the alpine m450 amp with 2-12" alpine type-e subwoofers and still kept the oem cd player. i have the amp and subwoofers connected to an adjustable rca line converter that is wired to the rear door speakers. and am using 4 gauge battery wire connected to the amp. the problem is this: i am getting loud, deep, pounding noise (about every 10 seconds) coming from the subwoofers when all doors of the pilot are completely closed and when the amp is turned on with music playing. however, when any of the doors are left open (and the amp is on with music playing) the noise is gone.... and then, when i close the doors again, the noise comes back! i searched these forums for hours looking for a resolution, but could not find someone with a similar problem. the amp is properly grounded. and power wire, battery wire, speaker wire, and ground wire are not running near each other.
i took it over to Sound Advice and the sales rep told me that if i change out the oem head unit to an aftermarket unit, the noise will go away. is this true? (after all, he is the sales rep). he also mentioned that when the doors are opened/closed the pilot will ground itself to turn the door light and dome light on/off.
ahhh!!!...someone please help me |
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| CMasten |
you have 2 subs installed yes? I would be curious to know if the problem goes away when you disconnect one of them. I dont think anything the sales rep is telling you is of value, no idea what he is talking about with the ground I also cant see where running another head unit would make a difference unless there is an issue with using the high level inputs on your amp.
Also you didnt mention this but I presume that you have the factory sub disconnected? Just tossing more items to work off of on the table. |
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| pointech |
I replied to your other post as well, but thought of more things:
1) is your Pilot 2wd? Might be part of noise cancelling system.
2) does it matter if the engine is on or off?
3) Do you have a spare battery/other car? If so you could temporarily power the amp from another vehicle. That would help identify if it is some sort of power issue.
In my younger days I installed upgraded equiment in my cars. Tracking down strange noises is no fun. Good luck! |
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| bigbobbusa |
| it's probably because you are dropping the rear speakers to a 2 ohm load and your hearing a popping because you are about to blow your radio. |
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| kingpilot06 |
quote:
Originally posted by CMasten
you have 2 subs installed yes? I would be curious to know if the problem goes away when you disconnect one of them. I dont think anything the sales rep is telling you is of value, no idea what he is talking about with the ground I also cant see where running another head unit would make a difference unless there is an issue with using the high level inputs on your amp.
Also you didnt mention this but I presume that you have the factory sub disconnected? Just tossing more items to work off of on the table.
ok...i disconnected one of the subs and the problem is still there.
i factory sub didnt come on my pilot, so there was nothing there for me to disconnect.
i agree with you regarding the sales rep, but its wierd though...it only happens with the doors all closed and the engine running
thanks for your input! |
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| kingpilot06 |
quote:
Originally posted by pointech
I replied to your other post as well, but thought of more things:
1) is your Pilot 2wd? Might be part of noise cancelling system.
2) does it matter if the engine is on or off?
3) Do you have a spare battery/other car? If so you could temporarily power the amp from another vehicle. That would help identify if it is some sort of power issue.
In my younger days I installed upgraded equiment in my cars. Tracking down strange noises is no fun. Good luck!
1. yes 2wd, i was reading some forums and it talked about the anc, but my problem happens even when my pilot is at a stand still (not just at certain speeds) (but what do i know?:D )
2. yes, only happens when the engine is on and the doors are all closed.
3. unfortunately, i dont have a spare...however, i just purchased the xterminator s-25a, 350 watt noise filter for the power line of the amp. i'm also waiting on a new head alpine 9856 head unit from crutchfield. i'm hoping these might remedy the problem |
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| kingpilot06 |
quote:
Originally posted by bigbobbusa
it's probably because you are dropping the rear speakers to a 2 ohm load and your hearing a popping because you are about to blow your radio.
but the noise only happens when the doors are all closed and the engine running. however, i am waiting on a new alpine 9856 head unit from crutchfield. i also have the xterminator s-25a, 350 watt noise filter that i will add also if i still hear noise with the new hu. i hope this will remedy the problem. |
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| CMasten |
so I have a few more Q's for you. What happens if you open the windows but close the doors? trying to acertain if this is acoustic or electronic in nature. What is the impedence of the woofers and are they wired in series (+ to -) or parallel (+ to +).
Also does is sound like an electronic issue? like the radio or amp is cutting off? maybe an overload protection kicking in, or a short its sensing perhaps? All the wiring is nice and neat and your sure there are non getting pinched where they might be shorting out when you increase the load? Not sure whey the doors would have anything to do with this, but that seems to be the needle in the haystack here :) |
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| kingpilot06 |
quote:
Originally posted by CMasten
so I have a few more Q's for you. What happens if you open the windows but close the doors? trying to acertain if this is acoustic or electronic in nature. What is the impedence of the woofers and are they wired in series (+ to -) or parallel (+ to +).
Also does is sound like an electronic issue? like the radio or amp is cutting off? maybe an overload protection kicking in, or a short its sensing perhaps? All the wiring is nice and neat and your sure there are non getting pinched where they might be shorting out when you increase the load? Not sure whey the doors would have anything to do with this, but that seems to be the needle in the haystack here :)
i still have the problem when the doors are closed and the windows open. the nominal impedence is 4 ohm on the woofers. i tried both ways to wire them, series and then parallel, now they are back to series. both methods produced the same annoying noise. the amp/radio doesnt seem to be cutting off...music/bass is perfect, the noise happens about every 10 seconds on top of the music. all wires are nice and neat and none are getting pinched. the volume level of the noise from the woofer is consistent even when i adjust the volume on the head unit. |
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| CMasten |
Tough one, not sure what the doors being closed would have to do with it. is it possible that you tied in the power leads to the same circuit that the interior lights are on?
If you can what happens if you tie the amp straight into the battery and eliminate the AC on/off circuit?
one more thought, I ran into a similar issue on an install once, where I had a mis match in the wiring, small gauge to large gauge, and it was causing a similar pop due to (I presume capacitance). I was adding in much larger wiring into the factory wires ( I only did that once!) I went with the same gauge wiring throughout and it went away, not sure why I didnt think of asking that before but 4 gauge wiring is pretty large and you may be having issues depending on how its stranded (many smaller wires or fewer larger ones). Totally just making guesses at this point, but heck if we find something that works! |
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| kingpilot06 |
quote:
Originally posted by CMasten
Tough one, not sure what the doors being closed would have to do with it. is it possible that you tied in the power leads to the same circuit that the interior lights are on?
If you can what happens if you tie the amp straight into the battery and eliminate the AC on/off circuit?
one more thought, I ran into a similar issue on an install once, where I had a mis match in the wiring, small gauge to large gauge, and it was causing a similar pop due to (I presume capacitance). I was adding in much larger wiring into the factory wires ( I only did that once!) I went with the same gauge wiring throughout and it went away, not sure why I didnt think of asking that before but 4 gauge wiring is pretty large and you may be having issues depending on how its stranded (many smaller wires or fewer larger ones). Totally just making guesses at this point, but heck if we find something that works!
LoL...we must be thinking a like...the power line that runs to the amp IS currently wired straight to the positive battery terminal. (the same terminal that the 4 gauge is wired to)
as for the 4 gauge wire i use, its high quality rockford fosgate braided wires. i'll be crossing my fingers when i install my new alpine hu and hoping that will resolve the problem i have.
do you think it could have something to do with the active noise cancellation??? i read some threads here and one of them mentioned that the anc is connected to the speakers. and since the subs are tapped into the rear speakers with an ADJUSTABLE LINE OUTPUT CONVERTER 2-50 WATTS. could the noise be amplified (the anc noise?) through the subs?...
when i get my alpine hu, i will be connecting the amp's rca cable directly to the aux input of the hu and power it through the hu.
maybe the combination of the anc, the line converter wired to the rear speakers and subs, and the amp has something to do with the noise?
is the anc only activated when the doors are all closed?
thanks for helping me cmasten! |
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| CMasten |
:) not sure how much help I have been to this point, but it sounds like you have been troubleshooting this right.
When you say you tapped into the rear speakers, I presume you mean you took the leads to the rear speakers and used that to tie into your amp hi-level input? the amp then just drives the subs and your not driving the rear speakers and the subs from the same amp? (i.e so your rear speakers and front speakers are being driving by the stock HU) I dont know anything about the ANC and that indeed to could be our culprit here Your new head unit will most likely be more user friendly though Im sure with an aftermarket amp and the like. I am very familiar with the 05 RES head unit but unfortunately dont know enough about the ANC or your head unit to maybe help you get to the chase here... maybe PTO or other of the auto-audiophiles may be of help. |
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| kingpilot06 |
quote:
Originally posted by CMasten
:) not sure how much help I have been to this point, but it sounds like you have been troubleshooting this right.
When you say you tapped into the rear speakers, I presume you mean you took the leads to the rear speakers and used that to tie into your amp hi-level input? the amp then just drives the subs and your not driving the rear speakers and the subs from the same amp? (i.e so your rear speakers and front speakers are being driving by the stock HU) I dont know anything about the ANC and that indeed to could be our culprit here Your new head unit will most likely be more user friendly though Im sure with an aftermarket amp and the like. I am very familiar with the 05 RES head unit but unfortunately dont know enough about the ANC or your head unit to maybe help you get to the chase here... maybe PTO or other of the auto-audiophiles may be of help.
yes. all you said above with the rear speakers/subs/and amp are correct. the door speakers are all powered by the head unit only. i should be getting the new head unit sometime this week and will post comments after i am complete (like i mentioned, i'm crossing my fingers and hoping this will resolve my problem)
btw: i'm looking for a link for the removal instructions/diagram of the 06 dash so i can replace the head unit. all i've been able to find were the 05 instructions. can you help? yeah, i know....i'm a needy person :2: |
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| pointech |
quote:
Originally posted by kingpilot06
do you think it could have something to do with the active noise cancellation???
ANC is my guess. If the Alpine headunit makes it go away that's better for you anyway (except for losing the steering wheel controls, but I think there is a fix for that too).
I'm still curious, has anyone added an amp to a 2wd Pilot? If you hear this noise through subs it is probably too low frequency for the regular speakers, maybe it is a test signal or something.
Anyways, congrats on your Pilot, subs and Alpine headunit! :) |
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| kingpilot06 |
quote:
Originally posted by pointech
Anyways, congrats on your Pilot, subs and Alpine headunit! :)
thanks...
yeah, i'm curious also, does anyone else on here have 2006 pilot lx 2wd with a system (amp, 2 12" subs, after market head unit) and still have the same problem? or...
does anyone just have an amp and 2 12" subs with oem head unit, with or without the same problem i have?
also, does anyone have a link for me to gert the directions on how to remove the factory head unit/dash on an 06 pilot lx without the navigation? crutchfield told me that they dont have the instructions yet. |
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| teddy_bear |
quote:
Originally posted by kingpilot06
also, does anyone have a link for me to gert the directions on how to remove the factory head unit/dash on an 06 pilot lx without the navigation?
Here is the link for the instalation instructions from Honda to install CD-changer, cassete player or MP3 player on 2006 Pilot LX: http://www.collegehillshonda.com/in...mp3indashlx.pdf
I too would like to replace my headunit on '06 LX, but was hesitant to do so. I am not sure if ANC relies on factory HU to work. Do you know if replacing factory radio with aftermarket HU will disable ANC, or if it still will be functional? |
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| kingpilot06 |
quote:
Originally posted by teddy_bear
Here is the link for the instalation instructions from Honda to install CD-changer, cassete player or MP3 player on 2006 Pilot LX: http://www.collegehillshonda.com/in...mp3indashlx.pdf
I too would like to replace my headunit on '06 LX, but was hesitant to do so. I am not sure if ANC relies on factory HU to work. Do you know if replacing factory radio with aftermarket HU will disable ANC, or if it still will be functional?
well, its funny that you ask that, but if you read how this thread started out, i think i might have problems caused by ANC...
but i'm not positive...
i know others are having a humming noise possibly caused by ANC (look in the "problems" forum, its recent).
thanks for the link!...as soon as i install my new head unit, i will post in this thread and let everyone know if i still have this problem that i started with. i'm hoping not...because its like listening to my pilot's heart beat (but really really loud from the subs) |
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| teddy_bear |
quote:
Originally posted by kingpilot06
well, its funny that you ask that, but if you read how this thread started out, i think i might have problems caused by ANC...
Yes, I read that, as well as all other stuff here about humming noise on ~55 mph. Apparently I do not have this problem on my '06 2WD LX - at least not yet (1.5K miles)...
I do not even know if factory radio is required for ANC to work - maybe I can just replace the HU, and keep the ANC. Or it might start making this infamous noise soon, and I will be glad to get rid of ANC completely...
Anyway, please keep us posted if replacing the radio fixes your problem. |
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| kingpilot06 |
quote:
Originally posted by teddy_bear
Anyway, please keep us posted if replacing the radio fixes your problem.
...will do.
thanks for your help! |
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| PTO |
| I didn't see that anyone asked this. The noise you hear, is also coming out of the door speakers? If not, then I would say it is either an amp problem or a problem with the wiring to it. I had a smiliar problem where I would get a really loud pop every 5 seconds once my amp got hot. I didn't change any wiring and just replaced the amp and never had another problem. |
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| kingpilot06 |
quote:
Originally posted by PTO
I didn't see that anyone asked this. The noise you hear, is also coming out of the door speakers? If not, then I would say it is either an amp problem or a problem with the wiring to it. I had a smiliar problem where I would get a really loud pop every 5 seconds once my amp got hot. I didn't change any wiring and just replaced the amp and never had another problem.
well, the amp is not wired to the door speakers. and the pop will only happen when the doors are all closed completely. other than that, when a door is left open, the pop is gone. wierd, huh? |
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| kingpilot06 |
| i think i narrowed it down to the ANC!....others having problems with the humming noise (with all factory stereo components) took my idea and drove with the door latched halfway...their noise went away also! read here |
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| cwahls |
I have been following you in the "deep humming" thread and may be able to add insight. I too am in your dilemma with the anemic stock system in the LX but am reluctant to do anything till we get our noise fixed.
I suspect the ANC. What happens with ANC is that the noise in the cabin is flipped in phase and then added to the stereo for reproduction thru the stock speakers. Since the stock speakers are rather incapable of low frequencies, there is a relatively high amount of pre-emphasis placed on them for the ANC to function. Now that you have added the bottom octave and it is quite capable of reproducing the lower frequencies they may be over exaggerated (over compensating) during the ANC function.
It seems pretty hush thus far as to how the ANC actually works, I'm very interested as to exactly how closed loop the ANC is. If there were a way to make it more adaptive then after market speakers would be easier to incorporate.
It's my wife's Pilot, now she has a noise and an anemic audio system and she is not an audiophile by far, she just wants a little more grunt to it. I plan to use the stock location. I plan to finish up the SQ system in my car within a month then start concentrating more on hers. I'll stay tuned :)
Chad |
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| kingpilot06 |
quote:
Originally posted by cwahls
I suspect the ANC......Now that you have added the bottom octave and it is quite capable of reproducing the lower frequencies they may be over exaggerated (over compensating) during the ANC function.
i agree! i hope that honda finds a permanent solution soon. i havent brought my pilot to the dealer yet, because i know they will blame the audio system that i had added. grrrr...i wish i would've just gotten the 4wd model! (but what am i gonna do with 4wd in southwest florida???:D ) i just hope that the noise goes away when i replace the factory stereo. otherwise, i'm gonna have to something with my subs and amp!
if you find something out, please let me know...thanks! |
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| cwahls |
quote:
Originally posted by kingpilot06
i agree! i hope that honda finds a permanent solution soon. i havent brought my pilot to the dealer yet, because i know they will blame the audio system that i had added. grrrr...i wish i would've just gotten the 4wd model! (but what am i gonna do with 4wd in southwest florida???:D ) i just hope that the noise goes away when i replace the factory stereo. otherwise, i'm gonna have to something with my subs and amp!
if you find something out, please let me know...thanks!
Will Do!
Yes they will blame the added equipment. At least you don't have the noise bone stock :) Like we do!
Chad |
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| kingpilot06 |
quote:
Originally posted by cwahls
Will Do!
Yes they will blame the added equipment. At least you don't have the noise bone stock :) Like we do!
Chad
hehe...yeah, thats a good way to look at it :p
i just read a post from jaxbill that said honda just said to disconnect the anc |
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| kingpilot06 |
my annoying noise went away!
:2:
i just installed my alpine 9856, and i'm a happy camper! |
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