| john150 |
| Can anyone advise how the pilot does in 6-12 inches of snow? I'm coming from an Explorer which did pretty well. |
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| ThePilotster |
| You'll be amazed.. the VSA works rather well... I came from Ford and Chevy... Honda has all wheel drive down to a science! You'll be passing people wondering why they can't move so well... be advised, still cant stop on ice worth a crap.... Drive safe |
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| mthomas |
| If you have the GY, I'd suggest changing the tires. AWD is not worth much with those tires. |
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| jl_ss |
| If you were happy with the Explorer, then you will be more than happy with the Pilot. Out Pilot performs better and feels more stable than my parents Explorer in the snow. We have the OEM Bridgestones. |
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| rocky |
quote:
Originally posted by mthomas
If you have the GY, I'd suggest changing the tires. AWD is not worth much with those tires.
I have to agree with that sentiment |
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| john150 |
| Is there any rhyme or reason as to which new pilots come with the Bridgestones as opposed to the Goodyears? |
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| whizmo |
quote:
Originally posted by john150
Is there any rhyme or reason as to which new pilots come with the Bridgestones as opposed to the Goodyears?
There was a theory that one plant that builds Pilots used one mfg, the other used a different one. But I think that was debunked. It appears to be luck of the draw.
When you're driving in serious snow (6"-12"), tires become critical and the Pilot's AWD system can be compromised pretty quickly if you get certain tires stuck. If I were visiting these sorts of conditions with any regularity, I'd mount full-blown snow tires every winter. All-seasons are going to let you down at some point.
- Mark |
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| lwschnell |
Have a 2005 Pilot EX with Bridgestones. Did not need use snow tires in Anchorage, AK during the winter of 2005. The roads were usually covered with compact snow & ice much of the time.
Overall performance was almost as good as Subaru Outback with studs. |
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| thomasj2 |
I run dedicated snows, anything much more than 8" of snow and you're hosed, (we don't have the ground clearance for much more than that). Over 8" you start to push a big pile of snow and you'll run out of traction.
I have an 800' driveway and 10" of snow is the max for even that short of a run. If the paved road has more than 8" wait for a plow truck. |
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| TR4Runner |
quote:
Originally posted by thomasj2
I run dedicated snows, anything much more than 8" of snow and you're hosed, (we don't have the ground clearance for much more than that). Over 8" you start to push a big pile of snow and you'll run out of traction.
I have an 800' driveway and 10" of snow is the max for even that short of a run. If the paved road has more than 8" wait for a plow
Wow, that's quite a long driveway. I'm surprised that 10" of snow is the limit for your Pilot. I understand the ground clearance is less than that, but if your tires still bite, you should be able to push through it.
Before I bought my 4Runner, I had a 4wd Ford Escape. I drove it through across a very large parking lot (empty factory lot near my house) with about 18 inches of untouched snow. I actually stopped a few times and was able to start moving again without any problems. The ground clearance of the Escape (and the tire size) is similar to the Pilot.
Also, I've easily been through even deeper snow with my 4Runner, but it also has bigger tires and higher ground clearance. Anyway, I would think the Pilot should be able to handle more than 10 inches of snow! |
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| gryphon75 |
| I've had no trouble in snows of about 14-16 inches with the stock goodyears. Yeah they suck but they did the job. Now with the x-terrains I would expect even better. Don't worry about ground clearance, Just because you have 8 inches of ground clearance doesn't mean you start pushing at 8.5 inches. The snow compresses under your tires and you gain back some of that height. By the way the Pilot does better in snow than my 4wd F-150. I for one was very impressed with it. |
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| jl_ss |
quote:
Originally posted by gryphon75
I've had no trouble in snows of about 14-16 inches with the stock goodyears. Yeah they suck but they did the job. Now with the x-terrains I would expect even better. Don't worry about ground clearance, Just because you have 8 inches of ground clearance doesn't mean you start pushing at 8.5 inches. The snow compresses under your tires and you gain back some of that height. By the way the Pilot does better in snow than my 4wd F-150. I for one was very impressed with it.
Wow, that's the second time I've read that a Honda/Acura AWD SUV does better than Ford's F150 in the snow. I'll have to stay away from Ford Trucks. My Chevy Silverado CC with 4WD and a locking diff. does a lot better in snow than our Pilot. Plus it has an AWD mode for those days when it is slippery in spots but too dry for 4wd. It'll definately go places our Pilot won't. |
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| door3 |
quote:
Originally posted by jl_ss
My Chevy Silverado CC with 4WD and a locking diff. does a lot better in snow than our Pilot.
I hope you don't hit the snow with your diff locked! WOHOOO! look out for trouble!:eek: |
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| door3 |
Hah! one of our members trying to see how much snow they can get around in? |
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| waynerd |
One thing to remember when going from the Explorer is it was REAR WHEEL DRIVE, and the Pilot is FRONT WHEEL DRIVE! I almost plowed into my neighbor's house a couple of times before I realized I had to change my snow driving style a bit. You don't accelerate through corners for starters. Oh yeah, you can't do donuts as well either:2: (you can do it, they're just bigger)
My Explorer with Michelin LTX M/S's seemed to have a BIT more snow traction, but it's kinda subjective. My Pilot had Cross Terrains. It'll be interesting this winter in my Ody with all-season tires.:( |
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| jonaz |
| It really depends on whether or not a F150 4wd has a limited slip differential or not. If it has limited slip, then a F150 will perform just as well in the snow. The Honda still holds an advantage if your driving on snowy roads, because the AWD system will handle turns better. You can think of limited slip and Hondas VTM as 3 wheel drive. Two wheels in the back, and one in the front will do all the turning. |
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| john150 |
| Is that so..there is only one drive wheel in the front on the pilot? When the rear engages is it always 2 turning in the rear? What does pushing the button on the dash actually do? |
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| gryphon75 |
| The F150 does have a limited slip diffferential. The major difference is the Pilot will actively spilt the torque among the wheels and the 150 has a predetermined torque split. Don't get me wrong the 150 will handle snow with no problem but the difference is the Pilot will do it with less thought or input from the driver. However the 150 can be more fun, just switch into 2wd and let her hang out! You can't do that in the pilot! |
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| charliekhonda |
Up here in the snowy Northeast, drove through a 18 inch snow storm in a Pilot.
Great snow vehicle. |
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| krygny |
quote:
Originally posted by john150
...
What does pushing the button on the dash actually do?
You didn't get an Owners Manual?
http://hondapilot.bkwon.net/manual/2005/p164.htm
I've gone through 10" of snow with the OEM Goodyears and didn't even use the VTM-4 lock. You should rarely, if ever, need to use it. (I now have Fortera TriipleTreds.) Once you go beyond the clearance of the vehicle (about 9"), you're turning it into a snow plow. |
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| john150 |
quote:
Originally posted by krygny
You didn't get an Owners Manual?
I didn't even get a Pilot. Still in the pre-purchase research stage.
Can you answer the other 2 questions in my post? Thanks in advance. |
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| andyschneider |
quote:
Originally posted by john150
I didn't even get a Pilot. Still in the pre-purchase research stage.
Can you answer the other 2 questions in my post? Thanks in advance.
The VTM-4 Lock button is only functional in lower gears and under (I think) like 15 mph. It locks the rear 2 wheels (I believe). The front doesn't have limited slip as best I can tell, but in real life driving through snow and ice, the normal VTM-4 (not locked at normal speeds) provides the proper rear-wheel torque for getting through snow. Have driven my wife's '04 through 2 winters thus far and my '06 through one, and even without the VSA it works like a charm - and that compares to a Tahoe, Jimmy and a Mazda MPV 4WD I've owned in the past. Don't dwell on the comparison between yours and the Explorer - it just works and you never have to do anything to get the torque you need. I've never used the VTM-4 lock button, even from a stop in deep snow.
andy |
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| krygny |
quote:
Originally posted by john150
I didn't even get a Pilot. Still in the pre-purchase research stage.
Can you answer the other 2 questions in my post? Thanks in advance.
Oops, soorreee - that's me being a wise@$$, which often just results in me being an @$$. :o
Some things I'm reading here don't make sense. I don't understand the reference or what is meant by "3 wheeled drive". Both front wheels are drive wheels. Somebody also posted something about limited-slip in the front. :confused: :8: The front has CV joints.
Here's my take on the Pilot's VTM-4 (copied from a previous post):
In ideal traction conditions (e.g., dry pavement), virtually all of the drive torque is applied to the front wheels. So most of the time, the Pilot effectively is a FWD vehicle. If the system senses slippage in the front wheels, additional torque is transferred to the rear. The amount of torque applied to the rear varies with the rate of slippage and there is some delay. Locking the VTM applies equal torque to the front and rear, making the Pilot true 4WD - except for two things: it has no low-range gearing and with the VTM lock engaged, the rear transaxial has no limited slip. Honda warns against locking the VTM on dry pavement. Also, it is NOT a "traction control" system. The wheels can be made to slip, no matter what.
In short, you should almost never need to engage the VTM lock, if ever. I've plowed through 10" of snow with mine and could not tell much of a difference with the lock on or off. The VTM handled it on its own just fine. |
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| boonecragun |
I live in the desert and didn't think i needed the 4wd so I just got the 2wd on my pilot. However, I will be traveling north for the holidays and will most likely encounter some snow. I was just curious does anyone know how the 2wd is going to handle in the snow compared to the 4wd. Has anyone had experience with the 2wd in snow? BTW i still have those excellent stock Goodyears on...
Does the VSA come in to play at all? |
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| mthomas |
I have driven my wife's oddy in the snow extensively (similar to Pilot).
With good tires it does about as well as most front wheel drive vehicles (pretty well). With poor tires (old, low-but-still-legal tread in my case) it can get dicey going up hills (where gravity, and weight distribution work against the vehicle). In one instance, I turned around and backed up a short-steep hill, just to get the weight over the drive wheels.
My opinion (as opposed to fact) on Pilot - VSA in limited traction environments - It's better at keeping the vehicle moving in an intended direction, not necessarily to keep the vehicle moving. It will limit throttle when wheels start to spin, which helps the tires stay on the edge of traction, but at the cost of momentum. When the hill is really steep and long, repeated cutting the throttle each time wheel spin is detected costs momentum, which is the traditional tool for getting through the slick spots.
In every case, tires suited to the conditiions will make a world of difference, in my experience. |
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| mikeslc |
Just want to share my experience with the VSA system in snow. I was out in the first major storm here in Utah a couple nights ago. The air temperature was in the teens and the road had accumulated at least 6 inches over a layer of ice. It was 2:30 am in the morning and no snow plow trucks out on the road yet. The first steep hill I came to I decided to test the Pilot's 4wd and VSA system out. I came to a complete stop at the base of the hill and stumped on the gas paddle all the way and no drama what so ever. The Pilot simply started moving forward with almost no tire spin. The pace wasn't brisk, but it did better than what I would have expected if I were to compare it to the Qudra-Drive equipped Jeep I used to drive. Once the Pilot started to move faster it would allow more and more tire spin, but the VSA would kick in to keep the Pilot moving in the intended direction. So I think the VSA system is pretty smart and it worked very well. I tried doing the same with VSA off and all 4 wheels would just spin like crazy and out right scary. I'm totally sold on the VTM and the VSA systems.
quote:
Originally posted by mthomas
My opinion (as opposed to fact) on Pilot - VSA in limited traction environments - It's better at keeping the vehicle moving in an intended direction, not necessarily to keep the vehicle moving. It will limit throttle when wheels start to spin, which helps the tires stay on the edge of traction, but at the cost of momentum. When the hill is really steep and long, repeated cutting the throttle each time wheel spin is detected costs momentum, which is the traditional tool for getting through the slick spots.
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| boonecragun |
| As luck wold have it, Salt Lake city will be my destinationin the coming weeks. Looks like I might be toast with my 2wd. I don't have the VTM. Stupid salesman said I would never need 4wd. I was sold on the better gas mileage vs. the 4wd which I would maybe use a handful of times in my ownership of the thing. Kind of regretting not getting the 4wd model. Hopefully the 2wd w/ VSA will get the job done. |
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| GreenMachine |
quote:
Originally posted by boonecragun
Stupid salesman said I would never need 4wd.
Sounds like a salesman without a 4WD to sell. :rolleyes: |
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| boonecragun |
| Nah, he had the 4WD's to sell. it is just that he had just purchased a 2wd and had been up in the "mountians" taking it wheelin' and said he never had a problem. So I wieghed my options and figured there would only be a handful of times that I would even need the 4wd. Oh well. Hopefully, my 2wd will shine in the snow this Christmas.. |
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| baron64 |
| Bought an '06 EXL 4WD for the AWD capability and safety for my wife and kids. I live in the Black Hills of South Dakota and took it out one morning after we got 6-8 inches of snow to see how it would do. Even with the OEM tires, I was very impressed with it's ability to handle deep, slushy snow and felt very safe with this vehicle. We live on a steep hill and had no problems. Granted, this was just one test, but I'm confident. Now, if we would just get some more snow... |
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| vgolla |
Just back from Tahoe -- literally, an hour ago -- and the first thing I did was go to tirerack.com to look for replacements for those Goodyear Integrity tires. The maddening part wasn't that the snow traction was worse than I expected -- though it was -- but the place where you go from "traction" to "no traction" is completely unpredictable. Felt far more confident in our '97 Subaru Outback. And we have two small children, so it wasn't like I was hanging a&&-out on Donner Summit, a la the Pikes Peak Rally.
I'm betting a tire-ectomy will make our beloved '05 Pilot -- and me -- feel much better. |
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| Edtardup6 |
wow realy hot! :) :)
regards, Edtardup6 |
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| DonP |
quote:
Originally posted by vgolla
Just back from Tahoe -- literally, an hour ago -- and the first thing I did was go to tirerack.com to look for replacements for those Goodyear Integrity tires. The maddening part wasn't that the snow traction was worse than I expected -- though it was -- but the place where you go from "traction" to "no traction" is completely unpredictable. Felt far more confident in our '97 Subaru Outback. And we have two small children, so it wasn't like I was hanging a&&-out on Donner Summit, a la the Pikes Peak Rally.
I'm betting a tire-ectomy will make our beloved '05 Pilot -- and me -- feel much better.
That sucks. We're going up to Tahoe City on Thursday for four days and the forcast says snow. This will be the first snow for us in the Pilot w/Integrity's. I guess I'll see how bad it is for myself.
How slow did you have to drive to feel safe? |
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| 74PILOTMOM |
So, I'm an oldie, but I remember the tire question IIRC; EX gets Bridgestone Duelers, and spend more money for the Leather, you get crapyears.
I replaced mine with Michelin Cross Terrains at 30K or so. I thought the Pilot did well despite it's goodyears, but feels much more substantial and controlled with the Cross Terrains. I drove in 5 inches of snow on top of ICE about a month ago, and this car was very impressive. Front wheel drivers were sideways spinning wheels and going nowhere up hills, I cruised right by, feeling a bit guilty. But happy!
Here's a pic of my pilot up near Canada in November, in a dusting. Just for fun :) |
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| vgolla |
Hey DonP from Funkytown. Sorry I didn't get back to you sooner and/or before your trip. :-(
I generally match the prevailing speeds when I'm on the freeways...sometimes a little more if I think the smokies are either dining or have already hit their quotas. But in crappy weather I turn down the boilers a bit. I'd say I was about 5 mph below prevailing speed from about Blue Canyon to Truckee, and probably closer to 10 mph below in turns. The thing that torqued me (no pun intended) is the GY's release point. With decent tires, you can sense that there's a lengthy transition from "nailed to pavement" to "a little jiggy" to "push me a little more, and I'm a&&-out." With the GYs, I always felt like I the space between "nailed" and "a&&-out" was about 2-3 mph. Which sucked.
Curious to hear how you did! |
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| rocky |
quote:
Originally posted by vgolla
The thing that torqued me (no pun intended) is the GY's release point. With decent tires, you can sense that there's a lengthy transition from "nailed to pavement" to "a little jiggy" to "push me a little more, and I'm a&&-out." With the GYs, I always felt like I the space between "nailed" and "a&&-out" was about 2-3 mph. Which sucked.
Curious to hear how you did!
Thats a real good assessment of the Pilot in snow on GYs. |
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| supo |
| Hey 74PM! Nice to see some glam shots of our '03 Pilots once in awhile! |
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| DonP |
She did fine. I think we were all doing 25-30 mph coming in over the peak on 80 where they had chain control. I drove very cautiously.I had a full load with 6 people, a baby, a dog and all our stuff. The antilock brakes only came into play a few times coming down a steep road from the condo.
I can't justify replacing the almost new Goodyears. Since the baby came along we only get up there once or twice a winter. Unfortunately I can't justify new skis and boots either.
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| Kalbo607 |
| Nice photo and glad to hear another story of how great the Pilot is. |
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| 74PILOTMOM |
quote:
Originally posted by supo
Hey 74PM! Nice to see some glam shots of our '03 Pilots once in awhile!
Hey! LOL, an oldie but a goodie ;)
Nice pic DonP, complete with icicles! |
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| borg |
quote:
Originally posted by 74PILOTMOM
Hey! LOL, an oldie but a goodie ;)
Nice pic DonP, complete with icicles!
74PM, that picture is sharp.....did you get a new camera?
Nice! |
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| DonP |
quote:
Originally posted by vgolla
I'm betting a tire-ectomy will make our beloved '05 Pilot -- and me -- feel much better.
Does the '05 have VSA? |
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| GreenMachine |
quote:
Originally posted by DonP
Does the '05 have VSA?
EX-L models only had VSA. :rolleyes: |
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| 74PILOTMOM |
quote:
Originally posted by borg
74PM, that picture is sharp.....did you get a new camera?
Nice!
Sorry! somehow I missed your post, Borg.
I just have a little Kodak easyshare 6.1MP. Works for most stuff :) Great for Pilot shots.
Hope all is well with you and the family, still enjoying the new job? |
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| PilotLX |
| We received a heap of snow here in Northen New Brunswick. I took the Pilot onto a snow covered laneway and sure enough I got the Pilot hung up in heavy packed snow. Cool to see all four wheels spinning but the truck wasn't moving!!! I walked to the nearest house with a 4x4 in the driveway...minutes later I was freed. So, even armed with studded Hakka tires...the Pilot was beaten by about 10-12" of snow!!!! I guess there was ice underneath...if the tires were able to get just a small bite...I think I would have made it. After this episode, the VSA light stayed on until I shut the truck off...upon restart the light went out and the VSA system worked again. |
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| robrecht |
quote:
Originally posted by PilotLX
We received a heap of snow here in Northen New Brunswick. I took the Pilot onto a snow covered laneway and sure enough I got the Pilot hung up in heavy packed snow. Cool to see all four wheels spinning but the truck wasn't moving!!! I walked to the nearest house with a 4x4 in the driveway...minutes later I was freed. So, even armed with studded Hakka tires...the Pilot was beaten by about 10-12" of snow!!!! I guess there was ice underneath...if the tires were able to get just a small bite...I think I would have made it. After this episode, the VSA light stayed on until I shut the truck off...upon restart the light went out and the VSA system worked again.
Did they laugh at you? |
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| PilotLX |
| Nah...folks here in the Maritimes are too good for that...instead of laughing, we help each other out!! Everyone with a 4x4 gets stuck sooner or later...how else would you know what your machine can do or not?? |
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| robrecht |
quote:
Originally posted by PilotLX
Nah...folks here in the Maritimes are too good for that...instead of laughing, we help each other out!! Everyone with a 4x4 gets stuck sooner or later...how else would you know what your machine can do or not??
Maybe a little different than New Brunswick, NJ :15: |
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| vgolla |
We have an 05 EX-L, so yepper, it has VSA.
Great to hear your trip went well and safely. I've settled down some RE the Integrities -- meaning, the 22'' Husqvarna chainsaw has been put away! -- and I'm thinking that come fall 07, I might have scubbed another 10K miles off the confounded things and can then make the ROI argument for Silent Armors, etc.
Have to say: The 06's front end looks much better than the 05's ... particular with a Chuck Norris-esque beard of icicles! :-) |
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| miles267 |
| I have a 2007 Pilot EXL 4WD and had it out tonight for the first time in the snow. The pilot did so amazing in the snow yet there was no indicator of when 4WD was active vs. not. Is there any type of visual indicator to know when the pilot VTM-4 mode has kicked in similar to VSA on the dashboard? Am guessing that once the vehicle begins slipping, VTM-4 mode will kick in until no longer needed (considering conditions tonight, it should've been running the entire time). Yet I had no idea of when it was active? Granted I did not put it into VTM-4 lock as I heard that this should not be done? |
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| The Other Tom |
| We got our first snow today and I drove the Pilot ( 07 Ex-L 4wd) to work. I pushed it a little bit to see what would happen. The traction control came on a couple of times, but as far as I could tell, the 4wd never came on...not sure how you tell anyway. The backend slid out once when I pushed it, but not too bad. No problems going up hills, etc. I noticed the ABS actived several times as I tried to stop, but no problems actually coming to a stop. |
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| miles267 |
| I too was out driving around the other night in Northwest Arkansas while it was snowing pretty good. People stuck everywhere, rear-wheel drive spinning out, yet I was able to buzz up and down hills w/o any problem aside from intermittent ABS kicking in. However all that time there was now VTM-4/.4WD indication anywhere that I could see/hear. I have to believe 4WD had been enabled at some point or I would have never made it home. Granted the pilot is front wheel drive but no front wheel drive vehicle goes that good in the snow. How do you know if/when 4WD has engaged? |
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| jfrano |
Do the newer Pilots give indication when VSC comes on?
Also what I did for my wife's new car, was to buy new tires and have the dealer swap before I took off the lot. Sold them on Greiglist and did quite nicely on price! |
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| dinkeldorf |
I don't think so. I've never seen it in "normal" driving here in Cowtown.
I tested it out in 10" of really light snow last winter in our 06 and no. What I did was floor it out of an (empty) intersection, a 90 degree left turn and I didn't see a light but the outside right front brake was pounding away.
Hasn't been enough snow to replicate the test since :)
quote:
Originally posted by jfrano
Do the newer Pilots give indication when VSC comes on?
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| GreenMachine |
quote:
Originally posted by jfrano
Do the newer Pilots give indication when VSC comes on?
I thought the exclamation point would come on, but I could be wrong. I RTFM, but I just can't remember exactly now.
I made a very last second turn one time (no one was behind me ;) ), and I thought I saw out of the corner of my eye something illuminate as the tires slid on some loose dirt in front of the business' driveway. |
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| The Other Tom |
quote:
Originally posted by GreenMachine
I thought the exclamation point would come on, but I could be wrong. I RTFM, but I just can't remember exactly now.
I made a very last second turn one time (no one was behind me ;) ), and I thought I saw out of the corner of my eye something illuminate as the tires slid on some loose dirt in front of the business' driveway.
The exclamation point came on for me when I pushed it in the snow. I assumed it was the VSC. |
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| vgolla |
I've only seen it (the exclamation point) flash once in our 05 Pilot, and that was when I purposely got on it on some ice in a very large, very empty intersection...just as an experiment. It flashed once, I felt the outboard brakes clamp down briefly, then all was well.
I've seen it several times in my 03 TL Type S ... but then again, that beast is dropping 260 HP thru just the front tires...if I didn't have VSA, I woulda turned my Yokos into smoldering donuts long ago! |
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| dinkeldorf |
This must be a trick question. If the VSC is working, your probably shouldn't be looking at the dash.
I second the comment on VSA. My S60 T5 is a tyre shredding machine and P6s are an expensive snack ;) |
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| milanparekh |
I live in Chicago and own a 2006 Pilot EX with less than 5,000 miles. We had a good amount of snow a couple of days ago but I wasn't worried because I had the Pilot with VSA. Well, I was not impressed with the VSA, actually I was disappointed.
The day started out with the Pilot fish tailing and spinning almost a 180 just leaving my driveway to turn onto the street, with VSA enabled. I didn't apply that much gas, just a little to get me going. Then when I got on the highway, which wasn't that cleaned up, the Pilot drifted as I applied enough gas to maintain speed, not accelerate. The only way I could stop the drifting was to let off the gas and coast. When I pulled into the parking lot at my work, the Pilot spun out again.
I gotta tell you, I am a little disappointed. So as a little test, I tested the VSA on a straight road with snow. From a full stop, I accelerated, trying to get the tires to spin out. For the most part, the tires did snip out, the VSA didn't decrease power to the tires. But there were brief moments where I could hear and feel the VSA in action as it tried to decrease power for traction.
Anyone else have this problem? Is this a defect with my Pilot's VSA? |
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| andrec8513 |
| Its a defect with the OEM tires! The Goodyears are horrible in snow and the Bridgestones are a close second! My wifes o5 Pilot has Nokian WR SUV tires on it and she was able to go thru 2 feet of snow without a problem. The end of the driveway was over the hood and it only took one try to get thru it. Do yourself a favor, get these Nokians, they are amazing in snow! |
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| krygny |
quote:
Originally posted by andrec8513
Its a defect with the OEM tires!
...
I must have gotten the ones without that "defect". I put three winters on the OEMs without VSA and none of that stuff ever happened to me (unless I wanted it to). |
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| GreenMachine |
| You can also try putting the column shift in second gear when you start from a stop. Is this mode, the Pilot will start in second gear instead of first which should help in maintaining traction. |
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| PilotLX |
| hogwash. placing the transmission in second gear will not dictate that it must start off in second gear. |
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| miles267 |
| I also have the Goodyear Integrity stock tires on my 2007 EX-L 4WD and, so far, haven't any issues with them during my first winter owning the vehicle. I only wish the Pilot had some sort of light indicator on the dash that alerted you when the 4WD was engaged. There was no way I would've gone as well in the snow as I had if it wasn't engaged, but always nice to have a visual confirmation similar to the VSA indicator, traction control, etc. |
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| Tupperware |
quote:
Originally posted by PilotLX
hogwash. placing the transmission in second gear will not dictate that it must start off in second gear.
RTFM, in my '06 it does. |
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| krygny |
quote:
Originally posted by Tupperware
RTFM, in my '06 it does.
The same since '03. In D3, it will start in 1st and not shift beyond 3rd, but in 1st or 2nd, it stays in the gear selected. |
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| sjlee |
quote:
Originally posted by Tupperware
RTFM, in my '06 it does.
Exactly. In my 2005 manual... it's on page 162. |
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| GreenMachine |
quote:
Originally posted by PilotLX
hogwash. placing the transmission in second gear will not dictate that it must start off in second gear.
Not only does our Pilot operate like this, but our CR-V does as well. Heck, my friend had an early 80's Honda Accord that worked like this. :rolleyes: |
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| nobby |
I am very pleased with the traction in snow that the Pilot offers...However...Knowing how good it is, I came to the end of my street to the boulevard and wanted to make a left turn from a stop. I waited for a gap in the traffic and off I went. I got about half way through the intersection and the Pilot died...for lack of a better word. What the .... then it kicked back on. I really don't care for THAT characteristic.
Scared the crap outta me. |
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| rocky |
quote:
Originally posted by nobby
I am very pleased with the traction in snow that the Pilot offers...However...Knowing how good it is, I came to the end of my street to the boulevard and wanted to make a left turn from a stop. I waited for a gap in the traffic and off I went. I got about half way through the intersection and the Pilot died...for lack of a better word. What the .... then it kicked back on. I really don't care for THAT characteristic.
Scared the crap outta me.
Switch off the VSA next time you're about to make the left hand turn.
Dam thing is too sensitive for my liking as well. Its one thing to have traction control, its another to shut down the engine.
That Honda feature is positively dangerous |
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| GreenMachine |
quote:
Originally posted by rocky
Switch off the VSA next time you're about to make the left hand turn.
Dam thing is too sensitive for my liking as well. Its one thing to have traction control, its another to shut down the engine.
That Honda feature is positively dangerous
Traction control is what is probably shutting down the engine due to wheelspin. Tracking in a direction other than where the fronts wheels are pointed is what VSA is supposed to correct by braking individual wheel(s). Snow is probably making both of these features work hard. I can't remember if anyone confirmed if traction control is turned off when VSA is off. Someone in an empty snowy parking lot should try this. No snow here in FL. ;) |
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| nobby |
quote:
Originally posted by rocky
Switch off the VSA next time you're about to make the left hand turn.
Dam thing is too sensitive for my liking as well. Its one thing to have traction control, its another to shut down the engine.
That Honda feature is positively dangerous
It's funny you mentioned turning off the VSA before the turn. I did try that in a different situation and man did it fishtail. The VSA certainly does a good job in overall control but perhaps it should recognize a standing stop / turn situation so as not to put the operator at risk. At least it has side impact air bags. |
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| sjlee |
quote:
Originally posted by nobby
It's funny you mentioned turning off the VSA before the turn. I did try that in a different situation and man did it fishtail. The VSA certainly does a good job in overall control but perhaps it should recognize a standing stop / turn situation so as not to put the operator at risk. At least it has side impact air bags.
When the weather is that bad, I would not try to pull into traffic if any problems accelerating could cause an accident. Regardless if the vehicle has AWD, I would either wait until there was a bigger opening... it's always a good idea to increase your safety margins when the weather turns bad. You never know if the person in front of you is going to stop (for whatever reason or your vehicle is going to have traction problems (on ice AWD just means all wheels will be slipping). |
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| rocky |
quote:
Originally posted by GreenMachine
Traction control is what is probably shutting down the engine due to wheelspin. Tracking in a direction other than where the fronts wheels are pointed is what VSA is supposed to correct by braking individual wheel(s). Snow is probably making both of these features work hard. I can't remember if anyone confirmed if traction control is turned off when VSA is off. Someone in an empty snowy parking lot should try this. No snow here in FL. ;)
I've turned vsa off and been happier. Then again, I've also learn to drive within its sensitivities. Suppose that does create a bigger safety margin. It remains overly sensitive for my liking |
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| nobby |
quote:
Originally posted by sjlee
When the weather is that bad, I would not try to pull into traffic if any problems accelerating could cause an accident. Regardless if the vehicle has AWD, I would either wait until there was a bigger opening... it's always a good idea to increase your safety margins when the weather turns bad. You never know if the person in front of you is going to stop (for whatever reason or your vehicle is going to have traction problems (on ice AWD just means all wheels will be slipping).
REALLY? Wow.....Thanks for the lecture.
I am driving my first NEW vehicule WITH traction control and 4wd. I don't think my last 6 cars cost as much as this ONE.
And now I must change my conservative driving habits to "blue haired lady" habits because of an interesting design characteristic of the Pilot?
Maybe I should park it in the winter and use my trusty Civic instead. |
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| sactoroy |
| Here's a picture of the snow fall in Arnold CA this past Thursday. We got about 8 inches at 4000 feet. The black line, between the two side mirrors is the road. I got stuck about 5 feet from the road as I tried to back out. I had it going pretty good but slowed down so I wouldn't shoot out into the road and my tires (Integrity's) started spinning. I tried VTM lock but no dice. We ended up shoveling as much snow from the front and back of the tires and managed to get it forward a bit before backing out again. On the drive up to Bear Valley, it tracked pretty well on a mixture of packed snow and fresh powder. I only felt it slide once, for a second, otherwise I was pretty happy considering the quality of the tires. |
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| shutrbug |
quote:
Originally posted by sactoroy
Here's a picture of the snow fall in Arnold CA this past Thursday. We got about 8 inches at 4000 feet. The black line, between the two side mirrors is the road. I got stuck about 5 feet from the road as I tried to back out. I had it going pretty good but slowed down so I wouldn't shoot out into the road and my tires (Integrity's) started spinning. I tried VTM lock but no dice. We ended up shoveling as much snow from the front and back of the tires and managed to get it forward a bit before backing out again.
I've got a place in Arnold as well (on Moran Rd.). I got there at about 10pm on Friday night and decided to give it a try to make it into the garage without snow-blowing first. Well, I didn't get up enough speed and got stuck with about two feet of the Pilot sticking out into the road. VTM-4 didn't help at all once stuck. After shoveling around the tires and snowblowing the driveway, I made it into the garage. It was the heavy chunks of snow from the road that the snow plow deposited in the driveway that were the Pilot's downfall. I don't think I would have made it without snow blowing anyway since the deepest accumulations were almost up to my knees. |
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| rocky |
If you think there is a chance of getting stuck, apply VTM4 FIRST.
At least that way, you'll get stuck even better. |
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| sactoroy |
quote:
Originally posted by shutrbug
I've got a place in Arnold as well (on Moran Rd.).
We stayed at a cousin's house, also on Moran Rd. It backs up to the golf course. Small world. |
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| nobby |
quote:
Originally posted by shutrbug
I've got a place in Arnold as well (on Moran Rd.). I got there at about 10pm on Friday night and decided to give it a try to make it into the garage without snow-blowing first. Well, I didn't get up enough speed and got stuck with about two feet of the Pilot sticking out into the road. VTM-4 didn't help at all once stuck. After shoveling around the tires and snowblowing the driveway, I made it into the garage. It was the heavy chunks of snow from the road that the snow plow deposited in the driveway that were the Pilot's downfall. I don't think I would have made it without snow blowing anyway since the deepest accumulations were almost up to my knees.
In my experience, taking "a run" at a snow bank generally puts you on top of it. I have had better luck trying to chew my way through using the four winter tires and the weight of the vehicle to do the job. Even that doesn't work all the time. |
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| juz |
For all those who want an indicator that the AWD is kicking in - it would be a complete pain in the a$$. Even in a straight line on completely dry pavement it kicks in with sufficient acceleration. In the snow and ice it is on almost any time you accelerate at anything but the slowest pace. You would have another light blinking in your face a pretty high percentage of the time you are driving.
As for the snow issue - I haven't had more than 4 or 5 inches to play with but have been impressed with the performance of the Pilot's systems. I have however had some issues adjusting to AWD as noted here:
http://www.hondapilot.org/forums/sh...&threadid=16995
My take is that the VSA and traction control (VTM) are largely seperate systems that work together to keep you under control. They seem to be getting discussed as one in this thread.
The VSA really only kicks in when you start getting out of shape (sideways or other) and you will feel the braking system kick in to rebalance the vehicle. I've had it work well for me on gravel roads and snow/ice (can't drift the way I used to) but it is not an autopilot mechanism - you can still lose control of your vehicle if you aren't driving with respect for the conditions.
I've also felt the situation where the traction control cuts power way too far and almost leaves you dead in the road but this takes pretty agressive driving before it happens (i.e. request for far more power by the driver than the roads can handle). Most of the time the traction control's actions are smooth and civilised, rarely noticeable - and I drive pretty aggresively and rely on it a lot under acceleration.
I did once play around with VSA off in the snow and it highlights how good the systems are pretty quickly. You can get sideways in a hurry (which is fun if you are expecting it but not so much in traffic).
Just my 2 cents. |
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| nobby |
quote:
Originally posted by juz
For all those who want an indicator that the AWD is kicking in - it would be a complete pain in the a$$. Even in a straight line on completely dry pavement it kicks in with sufficient acceleration. In the snow and ice it is on almost any time you accelerate at anything but the slowest pace. You would have another light blinking in your face a pretty high percentage of the time you are driving.
As for the snow issue - I haven't had more than 4 or 5 inches to play with but have been impressed with the performance of the Pilot's systems. I have however had some issues adjusting to AWD as noted here:
http://www.hondapilot.org/forums/sh...&threadid=16995
My take is that the VSA and traction control (VTM) are largely seperate systems that work together to keep you under control. They seem to be getting discussed as one in this thread.
The VSA really only kicks in when you start getting out of shape (sideways or other) and you will feel the braking system kick in to rebalance the vehicle. I've had it work well for me on gravel roads and snow/ice (can't drift the way I used to) but it is not an autopilot mechanism - you can still lose control of your vehicle if you aren't driving with respect for the conditions.
I've also felt the situation where the traction control cuts power way too far and almost leaves you dead in the road but this takes pretty agressive driving before it happens (i.e. request for far more power by the driver than the roads can handle). Most of the time the traction control's actions are smooth and civilised, rarely noticeable - and I drive pretty aggresively and rely on it a lot under acceleration.
I did once play around with VSA off in the snow and it highlights how good the systems are pretty quickly. You can get sideways in a hurry (which is fun if you are expecting it but not so much in traffic).
Just my 2 cents.
Pretty much sums up my feelings Juz. Only 4-5 inches? You guys have been getting off easy this year. |
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| shutrbug |
quote:
Originally posted by sactoroy
We stayed at a cousin's house, also on Moran Rd. It backs up to the golf course. Small world.
Mine too. I'm on the 9th fairway. |
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| shutrbug |
quote:
Originally posted by nobby
In my experience, taking "a run" at a snow bank generally puts you on top of it. I have had better luck trying to chew my way through using the four winter tires and the weight of the vehicle to do the job. Even that doesn't work all the time.
Good knowledge for next time. But I think we got 12-18 inches on Monday and when I go back on Friday night, I'm quite sure I'll have to snowblow the driveway this time. |
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| juz |
quote:
Originally posted by nobby
Pretty much sums up my feelings Juz. Only 4-5 inches? You guys have been getting off easy this year.
We've had way more than that but rarely all at once before it gets packed down or cleared. Snowed for 3 or 4 days straight a couple of weeks ago - would have been more like 2 feet but its just like skiing - you rarely get to find the untouched powder from more than a single days snow. |
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| sactoroy |
quote:
Originally posted by shutrbug
Mine too. I'm on the 9th fairway.
I don't know the layout of the course so I'm not sure what hole the house backs up to but we walked up to the lake and took this picture. |
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| shutrbug |
| My place is about three houses to the left of the house on the left.:D |
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| vgolla |
So we're just back from Truckee, and this time around my wife did some of the driving in and around town and the development (Tahoe Donner). The main roads had just been plowed; however, the smaller streets in the development still sported a delightful coating of snow, ice, and semifrozen goo. I say to my wife several times, "Be careful driving in that stuff." She comes back, says "Car drives great -- why do you drive it like a @$%((*@$%& grandpa?"
Oh oh.
Perhaps my behind's "moment of inertia detector" is overly sensitive. I did toy with a little VTM-4 Lock, and the Pilot (05 EX-L) pulled through some packed snow like a bull with a cattle prod wrapped around its unit.
Still gonna dump the Integrities into a ditch first chance I get ... just on general principle. |
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| coolcat |
I got my '03 EX a few weeks ago with Integrities that were showing a good bit of wear from underinflation and bad alignment. After doing a 180° last week in conditions that didn't warrant it I went looking for new tires. I had Bridgestone Dueler A/T Revos mounted on Tuesday.
It hasn't really snowed much since, and I was itching to try out the new kicks. I dropped my wife off at the mall last night and noticed a very lage section of the parking lot hadn't been plowed at all all year. When I went back to pick her up my son and I went for a little joyride! :D
Everything was pretty uneventful at first, I pushed through the mound of plowed snow pushed off the the side of the snowplow that was all around the area with no problem and went on to go for a little spin. Just as I was turning around to come back out my wife called me to say she was at the door. The distraction was just enough so that I didn't notice a slight problem. I was coming up on what I would later realize was a plow pile that had melted and then fresh snow had fallen on top of it, masking it so it looked like just a slight mound amidst the rest of the snow.
The Pilot pulled its way up on top of the ice mound with no problem, then it stopped. Doh!
That didn't make my wife happy, so she went back in to buy some shoes.
I shifted into 1st, engaged the VTM-4 Lock, gave it a little gas and just got spinning. Same thing in reverse. Sigh.
After much rocking back and forth, back and forth, 1st gear to reverse and back and forth, I was able to get it rocking enough that we broke free and got enough traction to move about 1.5 feet. Repeat the whole process and the second time I got all the way out.
I would have been stuck and in need of a pull if I'd tried that with those Integrities.
Getting back to the reason I got the new tires though. My Pilot doesn't have VSA, which is why it spun out on me. I'm used to driving my Ridgeline, which does have VSA, and my old CR-V which didn't put so much power to the rear when it engaged its 4 wheel drive. I've experienced the total lack of power in bad conditions when tring to push the Ridgeline too hard, its scared me a couple times. I've learned to hit the button to disable it if I'm going to try anything tricky when the roads are potentially slick. |
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| IowaPilot50 |
| I've had excellent results in the snow with my '06 EX-L. Iowa winters get awfully bad at times and the Pilot has never had a problem. I would recommend upgrading the tires for maximum performance, but my OEM Goodyears have 37,000 miles on them without a single problem. |
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| sagaliba |
| I have been driven 2wd vehicles for 30 yrs, never have problem with snow that is under 5" (ice is a totally different story). When snow is deeper, I just threw a shovel into my trunk, and would have to dig out when got stuck. I just bought my Pilot December 2006 as my first 4wd. We had some snow this winter, but none very deep. So could not say if it made any difference. Maybe it made me drive a little more confidently and a bit faster.:) |
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| bengelking |
It's all about the tires. You can have a vehicle with a phenomenal AWD system but if it has crap for tires, it will perform like crap. Conversely, if you have great tires, you can go almost anywhere and not get stuck - regardless of the vehicle. I had an Acura Integra with snow tires that seemed glued to snow. Without those tires, it was slip, slidin' away! Fun stuff!
I kept my Integrity tires for 60k and they were great in year 1 and got progressively worse every year after that. Put the Goodyear Triple Tred's on at 60k and LOVE THEM! These tires rock in all conditions. Great dry handling, sticky in the rain, they plow through snow and don't slip at all on ice. I went and put them on my wife's Passat as well and they rock on her car, too. Well worth the $$$. I've put 35k on these and they still look brand new and handle as well as day 1.
Any AWD or 4WD system is garbage without decent rubber. |
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