| fdiphill |
Hello Everyone,
I purchased an 06 2wd pilot a month ago, It finally snowed up here in Boston and I've noticed the Pilot hydroplanes very easy. We only had 6 inches of snow and when I tried to turn the wheel while going straight the pilot wouldn't turn with the wheel and I had to slow dowm almost to a complete stop to gain control again. My wife also to me when she made a turn with the pilot it started to slide into the curb and had to panic brake to get out of it. We've lost confidence in bad weather and want to gain it back again. The VSA is on and the tires aren't bad, what can help us get this under control? Any help would be appreciated.
Thanks,
fdiphill |
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| ctobio |
The OE Goodyear Integrities have a reputation for being poor performers in weather.
That said, if you had ice, anything short of snow tires will suck on any car. |
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| Pilot-Matt |
quote:
Originally posted by fdiphill
I purchased an 06 2wd pilot a month ago,
You needed a 4wd Pilot since you live in an area that gets snow/ice.
I do agree, you'll need to ditch the Integrities if you want the winter weather traction. |
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| ctobio |
quote:
Originally posted by Pilot-Matt
You needed a 4wd Pilot since you live in an area that gets snow/ice.
Lack of AWD has nothing to do with his hydroplaning, or sliding around. Thats all tire.
Not wanting to turn when the wheels were turned has nothing to do with his car being 2WD- in fact, the power wheels are the turning wheels in that situation. Again, it's lack of traction.
I went out last night in the ice in my FWD VW Passat, not the AWD Pilot. Why? Because the tires on my Passat are better (Goodyear Tripletreds FTW!), and I'm more used to its handling characteristics than my wife's Pilot.
Good tires, and knowing your vehicle's handling limitations, are key for winter performance. |
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| fdiphill |
Thanks everyone,
I'm glad everyone is on the same page with my problem being the tires, anyone have tire brand recommendations for winter driving up here in Boston?
Regards,
fdiphill |
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| ctobio |
quote:
Originally posted by fdiphill
I'm glad everyone is on the same page with my problem being the tires, anyone have tire brand recommendations for winter driving up here in Boston?
In an ideal world, you'd have a good set of snows, and swap them on in the winter. That would be best, but it won't be cheap.
Folks seem to like the Goodyear Tripletreds. I have them on my VW Passat (obviously the passenger car version, not the SUV version) and have been very happy with them. I have 40,000 miles on them, and I should get at least another 20,000 before enough tread has worn on them to have them be not very good anymore. They have phenomenal wet traction, and are decent for an all season tire in snow and ice. One thing is that they're a little louder, and have a little more rolling resistance.
I will probably get the same tires for my wife's Pilot when her tires are done. |
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| jl_ss |
quote:
Originally posted by fdiphill
Thanks everyone,
I'm glad everyone is on the same page with my problem being the tires, anyone have tire brand recommendations for winter driving up here in Boston?
Regards,
fdiphill
I'd second the goodyear triple treads. Our Pilot sees a 80 mile commute daily in all weather conditions. They have performed excellently in all the snow we've had this year. My wife drove it home (40 miles) in the middle of yesterdays snow storm with no problems at all.
There are quite a few threads dealing with tires that can be found with the search function. Here is a good comparison site: Tire Rack Survey Results. |
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| Pilot-Matt |
quote:
Originally posted by ctobio
Lack of AWD has nothing to do with his hydroplaning, or sliding around. Thats all tire.
I agreed that the tires are the issue, but I still prefer to have a 4wd Pilot for the added traction and stability for the Winter conditions where I live. That's why I decided on the Pilot. |
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| tseeb |
| Isn't hydroplaning caused by water, not snow? I've felt it some in CA the last two months in my 4WD Pilot with OEM Bridgestones that are getting worn, but still have tread. I find slowing down reduces hydroplaning. |
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| ctobio |
quote:
Originally posted by tseeb
Isn't hydroplaning caused by water, not snow? I've felt it some in CA the last two months in my 4WD Pilot with OEM Bridgestones that are getting worn, but still have tread. I find slowing down reduces hydroplaning.
Under certain conditions, when snow gets compressed it melts. There's your hydroplaning.
It's entirely possible that while he experienced a sensation similar to hydroplaning, it may not have been hydroplaning in the classic sense- just slippage on ice and snow. Either way, it's still tires.
quote:
I agreed that the tires are the issue, but I still prefer to have a 4wd Pilot for the added traction and stability for the Winter conditions where I live. That's why I decided on the Pilot.
I maintain that AWD has its use, which is to keep you going in a straight line, or getting you out of a situation where it would be beneficial to have the drive wheels be at the other end of the car- say, being stuck in snow.
AWD is not some magic traction aid. Give me a FWD with snow tires and it will match or outhandle an AWD with the best all-season tires in the snow. The only advantage to AWD is that you can get yourself out of a ditch.
The reason I have a Pilot is for the ground clearance. The reason I have AWD is for that "get me out of a ditch" capability. Once I'm moving, AWD means nothing to me. |
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| xGS |
quote:
Originally posted by ctobio
AWD is not some magic traction aid. Give me a FWD with snow tires and it will match or outhandle an AWD with the best all-season tires in the snow. The only advantage to AWD is that you can get yourself out of a ditch.
The terrain in your area must be relatively flat.
Come to a stop at an intersection on a sufficiently steep grade in bad weather and the AWD will get going again while the FWD will just spin in place. |
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| Blkblurr |
| I've had my Pilot since 2004 and have had the integretys on it all this time. I live in Ohio and we get frequent snow and ice. I have not had any problems with getting around in this kind of weather. I also have an old Accord and don't have any issue in this weather. It seams to me that the issue may be the drivers experience with the Pilot. The other issue that some have brought up here about 4WD vs Awd. For me I prefer the AWD. In 2004 we had 25" of snow the day before Christmas and this was the first time we drove the Pilot in snow. I tried it in locked 4WD and AWD and the AWD gave me much better control. |
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| krygny |
quote:
Originally posted by fdiphill
Hello Everyone,
I purchased an 06 2wd pilot a month ago, It finally snowed up here in Boston and I've noticed the Pilot hydroplanes very easy. We only had 6 inches of snow and when I tried to turn the wheel while going straight the pilot wouldn't turn with the wheel and I had to slow dowm almost to a complete stop to gain control again. My wife also to me when she made a turn with the pilot it started to slide into the curb and had to panic brake to get out of it. We've lost confidence in bad weather and want to gain it back again. The VSA is on and the tires aren't bad, what can help us get this under control? Any help would be appreciated.
Thanks,
fdiphill
Begs a few questions:
- How many miles on the current tires?
- Are they properly aligned, inflated and is the tread even?
- What kind of vehicle are you used to driving?
- You mention hydroplaning and snow together. Are both a problem?
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| fdiphill |
Hello,
I have 13K on the current tires, alignment is straight and tires are properly inflated and even.
We drove a Grand caravan for 8 years prior to this purchase and we're having both issues hydroplaning (moreso around corners) and slushy snow.
Regards,
Fdiphill |
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| whizmo |
I hate to be a stickler for terminology, but what you're experiencing is definitely not hydroplaning. It's sliding on snow and ice.
- Mark |
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| fdiphill |
My mistake I thought since it happens in rain as well as snow there would be some hydroplaning involved. Either way am I to assume the tires are simply garbage and better tires are needed for greater traction?
Regards,
fdiphill |
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| flyalteon |
After some near disasters of slipping and sliding around with the stock Goodyear Integrity tires this winter (I have AWD) I swapped over to Michelin LTX's (bought at Costco). I was very close to buying Goodyear Silent Armor tires, but the Mich's were cheaper and closely rated (per www.tiretrack.com).
Not only are they much better in snow, they are much, much quieter on the road. General overall handling is also much improved. Its very disappointing that Honda puts such shabby tires on their new Pilots. |
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| fdiphill |
flyalteon,
Thank you for the tip, I'll check them out.
Regards,
fdiphill |
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| whizmo |
Hydroplaning is defined as the name suggests: planing on a cushion of water that builds up under the tread faster than the tire can channel it away from the contact patch. To hydroplane takes a smooth road, higher speeds, and standing water. None of these are generally present when you're driving on snow or slush covered roads.
Any one's experience with traction on snow/ice is extremely anecdotal and local weather conditions can make an order of magnitude difference in available traction. So it is really difficult to relate one person's experience in one winter storm with a different person's in another storm. This is the reason you get people using Brand X of tire who think they are treacherous while another person reports they work fine.
The stock tires that come on the Pilot are Okay all-season tires. You can do better with better brands of all-seasons, but it is not going to make a huge difference. If you are sliding around on the stock tires and you really want to make a difference, dedicated winter/snow tires are the way to go.
- Mark |
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| krygny |
quote:
Originally posted by whizmo
I hate to be a stickler for terminology, but what you're experiencing is definitely not hydroplaning. It's sliding on snow and ice.
- Mark
People tend to use the term "hydroplaning" falsely and loosely. Skidding on wet pavement and hydroplaning are not the same. I've skidded on wet pavement (unintentionally and intentionally) literally hundreds of times. I've only experienced hydroplaning two or three times in my entire life.
And if you're skidding or sliding in snow or slush, you're just plain going too fast. Slow down. |
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| ctobio |
quote:
Originally posted by krygny
People tend to use the term "hydroplaning" falsely and loosely. Skidding on wet pavement and hydroplaning are not the same. I've skidded on wet pavement (unintentionally and intentionally) literally hundreds of times. I've only experienced hydroplaning two or three times in my entire life.
Yep. The best way I can describe hydroplaning is that it's a sensation not unlike floating. Essentially, there is a thin film a water between the rubber and the road. I can feel when all 4 tires are sticking to the pavement. In a hydroplane situation, you are moving forward, but there is no sensation of traction. It's hard to really describe. A wet skid maintains some level of traction, albeit diminished. You don't have full control, but you do have varying levels of traction at each corner.
One could say you could almost get a sensation of hydroplaning on slush, but certainly not on snow. That's just plain slipping.
quote:
And if you're skidding or sliding in snow or slush, you're just plain going too fast. Slow down.
Yep. Very true. |
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| netman88 |
I say 4WD also. In addition get some good tires.
I think Michelins.
You can look at www.discounttire.com (enter your vehicle to see what tires match your vehicle). |
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| whitey |
| Slowing down would be the cheapest solution to your skidding... Just my 2 cents... |
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| fdiphill |
| For what it's worth I keep reading posts that say to slow down, I'm slipping and sliding going 5 MPH with these OEM tires, I never had a vehicle that looses control at such low speeds, I do agree the tires are cheap and replacing them may help, but again speed is not an issue that is why I have posted this. Again people speed is not the issue. |
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| Blkblurr |
quote:
Originally posted by fdiphill
For what it's worth I keep reading posts that say to slow down, I'm slipping and sliding going 5 MPH with these OEM tires, I never had a vehicle that looses control at such low speeds, I do agree the tires are cheap and replacing them may help, but again speed is not an issue that is why I have posted this. Again people speed is not the issue.
then there must be something else wrong because my pilot has never done that. My 89 Accord has never done that unless I was on smooth hard ice. |
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| fdiphill |
| I agree it should'nt loose control at such low speeds, can bad tires do this to an SUV (only 13K on them), I've had cars and minivans with less tire tread that seemed much more stable. |
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| Blkblurr |
quote:
Originally posted by fdiphill
I agree it should'nt loose control at suck low speeds, can bad tires do this to an SUV, I've had cars and minivans with less tire tread that seemed much more stable.
If they are really bad it can. The pilot has alot of torque and can break loose easily if your not carful when you take off. I however have not driven the 2wd verson so I'm relying on my experience with my AWD Pilot. I still have the Integritys on my Pilot and have no trouble with traction at all. |
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| krygny |
quote:
Originally posted by fdiphill
For what it's worth I keep reading posts that say to slow down, I'm slipping and sliding going 5 MPH with these OEM tires, I never had a vehicle that looses control at such low speeds, I do agree the tires are cheap and replacing them may help, but again speed is not an issue that is why I have posted this. Again people speed is not the issue.
If you're saying the car is uncontrollable, there's something wrong with the car. Have it serviced. I put three winters on the OEM Integritys and they handled fine. Not great, but not like the car was unsafe or unmanageable. The Pilot still handled better in the snow than any passenger car I've driven (including a FWD Subaru).
You're obviously experiencing something that the rest of us don't. Something that is not inherent in all Pilots. |
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| whizmo |
quote:
Originally posted by krygny
You're obviously experiencing something that the rest of us don't.
Or haven't yet.
The reason is not the tires, it's VERY SLICK roads. I don't care what speed you're going, there are weather conditions that will make it too fast. We've all seen the news videos of people sliding around like hockey pucks with their cars at less than walking pace and after their car hits something and stops, they can't even get out of the car and stand up. Is it their tires? Well, that might be a contributor, but the main reason is just that the roads are extremely slick in certain weather conditions.
Believe me, if you're sliding dangerously at 5mph, changing to another brand of all-season tires is just going to mean that you slide at 6mph.
- Mark |
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| jay |
In my daily commute to McLean, VA, there's an exit ramp off 495 to 123 where you have to slow extremely quickly, then goose it at the bottom of the ramp to merge into traffic. One August morning in 2003, with 18,000 miles on the Integrity's, I made that same commute on that same route on a yet-again wet road, and those Intregity's did what they always did. The rear tires seemed to break traction, and the rear would start to slide a bit on me.
That afternoon I swapped them out for Cross Terrains, and never experienced that issue ever again. |
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| Blkblurr |
quote:
Originally posted by whizmo
Or haven't yet.
The reason is not the tires, it's VERY SLICK roads. I don't care what speed you're going, there are weather conditions that will make it too fast. We've all seen the news videos of people sliding around like hockey pucks with their cars at less than walking pace and after their car hits something and stops, they can't even get out of the car and stand up. Is it their tires? Well, that might be a contributor, but the main reason is just that the roads are extremely slick in certain weather conditions.
Believe me, if you're sliding dangerously at 5mph, changing to another brand of all-season tires is just going to mean that you slide at 6mph.
- Mark
He did say 6" of snow not ice. |
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| whizmo |
quote:
Originally posted by Blkblurr
He did say 6" of snow not ice.
And anyone who has ever driven in winter conditions knows that 6" of snowing will result in a wide range of actual traction conditions on the road ranging from from 12" of snow, to bare wet pavement, to a 1/2" of glare ice, all changing hour by hour as traffic, plowing and chemicals work their magic over freeze/thaw cycles.
- Mark |
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| Blkblurr |
quote:
Originally posted by whizmo
And anyone who has ever driven in winter conditions knows that 6" of snowing will result in a wide range of actual traction conditions on the road ranging from from 12" of snow, to bare wet pavement, to a 1/2" of glare ice, all changing hour by hour as traffic, plowing and chemicals work their magic over freeze/thaw cycles.
- Mark
Of course. He didn't say he was on ice though. |
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| colorider |
quote:
Originally posted by jay
One August morning in 2004, with 18,000 miles on the Integrity's, I made that same commute on that same route on a yet-again wet road, and those Intregity's did what they always did. The rear tires seemed to break traction, and the rear would start to slide a bit on me.
That afternoon I swapped them out for Cross Terrains, and never experienced that issue ever again.
:confused:
I thought you owned your '04 Lexus RX 330 then? Bought in Feb '04, IIRC.
See what happens when you trade cars so often?!?!! :headslap: |
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| fdiphill |
Blkblurr,
Your correct it was about 6" of slushy snow where I lost control and my wife lost control making a turn on about 2" of compact snow. There was no ice involved.
Regards,
fdiphill |
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| jay |
quote:
Originally posted by colorider
:confused:
I thought you owned your '04 Lexus RX 330 then? Bought in Feb '04, IIRC.
See what happens when you trade cars so often?!?!! :headslap:
Exactly. I had trouble remembering, largely because I bought my '03 Pilot in May of '02.
Good memory. But I can't even begin to remember when you went from the Pilot to the Ridgeline to the Camry to the BMW to the Mazda, with a PT Cruiser in the mix there somewhere with about 6 motorcycles. :p |
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| colorider |
quote:
Originally posted by jay
Exactly. I had trouble remembering, largely because I bought my '03 Pilot in May of '02.
Good memory. But I can't even begin to remember when you went from the Pilot to the Ridgeline to the Camry to the BMW to the Mazda, with a PT Cruiser in the mix there somewhere with about 6 motorcycles. :p
Don't forget two S2000's and it was more than 6 motorcycles I'm sure!!!
:cool: |
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| tmurphy171 |
quote:
Originally posted by fdiphill
For what it's worth I keep reading posts that say to slow down, I'm slipping and sliding going 5 MPH with these OEM tires, I never had a vehicle that looses control at such low speeds, I do agree the tires are cheap and replacing them may help, but again speed is not an issue that is why I have posted this. Again people speed is not the issue.
I have had this happen when turning in snow at slow speeds. It was caused by making the turn TO SHARP. The Pilot is heavy and will continue to go in the direction it was going in if you turn the wheel sharply in snow regardless of what tires on it |
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| 5Gs |
| somehow I'm having a hard time figuring out how you can possibly lose traction when you're going 5mph as you claim on 6" of slushy snow. how do you know there's no ice underneath? |
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| fdiphill |
| As I was going through it I could see wet black asphault from other cars tire tracks that were driving ahead of me. It was a warm day just after a night of snow so the streets were starting to hit pavement in certain areas. If I was sliding on ice it would have certain feel to it , this out of conrol feeling was different, for example on ice you would slide much faster then sliding on snow or slush so I can exclude ice as a contributing factor. |
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| whizmo |
quote:
Originally posted by fdiphill
If I was sliding on ice it would have certain feel to it , this out of conrol feeling was different, for example on ice you would slide much faster then sliding on snow or slush so I can exclude ice as a contributing factor.
So we are sliding on something that slides much slower than ice, yet makes the car virtually uncontrollable at 5mph. Okay....
- Mark |
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| jay |
| Regardless of what it was, it seems it's time for the OP to find a better tire. Of course, as I've mentioned in a couple of threads, I wasn't all that impressed with the Pilot's "stability" in any sort of adverse condition compared to other 4WD or AWD vehicles I've owned, so take it with a grain of salt. |
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| tmurphy171 |
quote:
Originally posted by 5Gs
somehow I'm having a hard time figuring out how you can possibly lose traction when you're going 5mph as you claim on 6" of slushy snow. how do you know there's no ice underneath?
A Pilot with OEM tires handles like its on marbels in 6 inches of slushy snow IMO. |
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| colorider |
Since this is related to TIRES...........
Moved thread to Tires and Wheels
:) |
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