| 75blazer |
| Does anyone know if I need separate containers for motor oil, transmission fluid and VTM-4 fluid to bring them in for recycling? |
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| sblvro |
quote:
Originally posted by 75blazer
Does anyone know if I need separate containers for motor oil, transmission fluid and VTM-4 fluid to bring them in for recycling?
all the oils are dumped in one bin AFAIK. |
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| N_Jay |
quote:
Originally posted by 75blazer
Does anyone know if I need separate containers for motor oil, transmission fluid and VTM-4 fluid to bring them in for recycling?
Trans and VTM are ok mixed. They are both hydraulic fluid.
The oil should be separate.
I am not sure how important this is, but I know brake fluid will ruin oil for recycling. |
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| 75blazer |
| Thanks for the fast replies. I made few phone calls and no one seems to know for sure, so I think I'll just play it safe and keep them separate. I suppose $8 for another container is a small price to pay to keep it out of a landfill. |
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| N_Jay |
quote:
Originally posted by 75blazer
Thanks for the fast replies. I made few phone calls and no one seems to know for sure, so I think I'll just play it safe and keep them separate. I suppose $8 for another container is a small price to pay to keep it out of a landfill.
$8?? |
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| sblvro |
| just bring it to pepboys or autozone and they will take it for free. |
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| ctobio |
I take mine to the town dump. In that bin I can put used oil, transmission fluid, brake fluid, or antifreeze. Apparently it all goes in the same tanker to the recycling place, and they do their stuff to it when it gets there.
Just don't put gasoline or diesel. That they don't like. |
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| mmmmark |
I'm not sure if it is a state law (I live in TX) or federal law, but at least here, EVERY place that does oil changes HAS to accept used oil for recycling.
I take mine to the jiffy lube since it is closest to my house.:cool:
I bring in my container, dump it and take it back home to refill again! |
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| 75blazer |
quote:
Originally posted by ctobio
I take mine to the town dump. In that bin I can put used oil, transmission fluid, brake fluid, or antifreeze. Apparently it all goes in the same tanker to the recycling place, and they do their stuff to it when it gets there.
Just don't put gasoline or diesel. That they don't like.
At $4.19 a gallon you better believe I'll find a use for the gas before I dump it!
There is no shortage of places I can take the oil. My concern is possible contamination if I mix transmission fluid and motor oil. If I do, could it potentially render the entire batch unfit for recycling? |
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| N_Jay |
quote:
Originally posted by 75blazer
At $4.19 a gallon you better believe I'll find a use for the gas before I dump it!
There is no shortage of places I can take the oil. My concern is possible contamination if I mix transmission fluid and motor oil. If I do, could it potentially render the entire batch unfit for recycling?
The more mixed, the more work and cost to recycle.
I guess some places assume the worst and then don't ask people to keep it separate, other places try for a modicum of efficiency and do ask people to keep it separate.
I place I used to take it to in CA (years ago) told me they test his used oil when they pick it up, and if it had brake fluid of other things in it he was charged an additional fee. |
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| normkol |
The last time I brought trans fluid, they wouldn't take it. This was a parts store, RS Strauss.
They would only take motor oil. |
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| jarizzo |
It all depends on what they mean by "recycling." Sometimes, recycling means re-refining the product and selling it as a new product. Sometimes recycling means using the oil in an oil-burning furnace. The furnaces will burn pretty much anything, so places that do that don't care much about what's in there as long as there's no water or antifreeze. If it's going to be re-refined, they're more selective about what gets mixed with what. I take mine to a local mechanic shop that burns the used oil. They don't look at it or smell it or anything. Into the fuel tank it goes and they heat the building almost for free in the winter. With rising energy prices, this may become more common practice. Since I usually have transmission fluid, gear oil, power steering fluid, brake fluid, engine oil, and stale 2-cycle gas all mixed together, it's much easier to find a place that just burns it.
John
:7: |
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| 75blazer |
quote:
Originally posted by jarizzo
It all depends on what they mean by "recycling." Sometimes, recycling means re-refining the product and selling it as a new product. Sometimes recycling means using the oil in an oil-burning furnace. The furnaces will burn pretty much anything, so places that do that don't care much about what's in there as long as there's no water or antifreeze. If it's going to be re-refined, they're more selective about what gets mixed with what. I take mine to a local mechanic shop that burns the used oil. They don't look at it or smell it or anything. Into the fuel tank it goes and they heat the building almost for free in the winter. With rising energy prices, this may become more common practice. Since I usually have transmission fluid, gear oil, power steering fluid, brake fluid, engine oil, and stale 2-cycle gas all mixed together, it's much easier to find a place that just burns it.
John
:7:
I see you're in Chicago, I am too. Where is this place? I'd be happy to help someone get free heat. I've heard that the oil burners you're talking about actually burn quite clean too. |
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| N_Jay |
quote:
Originally posted by 75blazer
I see you're in Chicago, I am too. Where is this place? I'd be happy to help someone get free heat. I've heard that the oil burners you're talking about actually burn quite clean too.
There are laws about burning off-specification (normally untested) oil that is not from On-Site in small heaters.
Remember, everything in that oil ends up in the air. (Lets save some energy and put some heavy metals in the air. Good choice):rolleyes: |
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| jarizzo |
quote:
Originally posted by N_Jay
There are laws about burning off-specification (normally untested) oil that is not from On-Site in small heaters.
That's why there's a market for maintaining, fixing, and selling old oil burning furnaces. They were made before the laws took effect and are grandfathered in. Shops will pay top dollar for those things and I understand why. Those laws don't exist everywhere. They probably do in the Chicago area, but you can still buy new used oil furnaces, so that can't apply everywhere.
quote:
Remember, everything in that oil ends up in the air. (Lets save some energy and put some heavy metals in the air. Good choice):rolleyes:
If they're not burning my used oil, they're burning natural gas or propane, both of which came from oil rigs, refineries, and distribution systems, all of which require lots of energy. The energy they use probably comes at least 80% from coal, which puts plenty of heavy metals and worse stuff in the air. By taking my used oil in to be burned, the drilling, refining, and most of the distribution energy are saved, and while it does put a small amount of metals in the air, I argue the net amount is similar to or less than what would be created by using natural gas or propane in the first place.
If you can show me that the contaminants in my used oil wouldn't wind up in the environment otherwise, I'll consider taking the oil elsewhere. In the meantime, though, I don't think it makes any difference either way. It's getting recycled one way or the other, saving 50-85% of the energy needed to use new oil, and the pollutants wind up in the air or the water anyway. Rerefining the oil doesn't make them magically go poof. What do they do with all the stuff that comes out of the oil?
The American Petroleum Institute says that burning used oil is a primary means of recycling it. Just like used tires, used oil fires cement plants, power plants, furnaces, and is burned in other places for the energy it contains. It still costs less money and energy to burn the used motor oil, so the net increase in heavy metals in the environment is probably small if there is any increase at all.
Of course I'm open to new information and ideas, so, for the sake of the planet and the human race, please enlighten me. |
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| N_Jay |
Sidestepping environmental laws by using grandfathered (usually not as clean) equipment in the name of being "environmentally sensitive" is a fools game.
Larges users of recycled oil have to meet local and federal environmental restrictions.
Small users do not (hence why they are usually restricted from taking in other's oil to burn).
You are making some fairly poorly substantiated assumptions.
I was only stating there are restrictions. |
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| jarizzo |
quote:
Originally posted by N_Jay
Sidestepping environmental laws by using grandfathered (usually not as clean) equipment in the name of being "environmentally sensitive" is a fools game.
Larges users of recycled oil have to meet local and federal environmental restrictions.
Small users do not (hence why they are usually restricted from taking in other's oil to burn).
You are making some fairly poorly substantiated assumptions.
I was only stating there are restrictions.
I'm pretty sure a cement plant that burns used oil isn't doing any quality control on the inputs or the outputs, whether they're burning used tires or used oil. The shop that burns my oil might well have a modern, licensed burner. All I see is the tank where they dump it. I don't know if it's an old one or a newer one under "restrictions." I was just pointing out that people do still use the old ones.
What kind of restrictions do they have? How do those restrictions change what or when the contaminants wind up in the environment? They only care about saving energy costs, and using recycled products still saves energy in the end and the waste products wind up in the environment anyway, only there are less contaminants using recycled products than using new ones. To me, that looks like the net result is less energy consumption and pollution. Even if they are scrubbing the combustion gases, that stuff winds up in the landfill anyway right? What else do they do with it? Air or water, where do you want my used oil contaminants to go? Why is one better than the other?
It seems like you're suggesting that "controls" and "restrictions" somehow magically remove the contaminants from the environment. Where does the stuff go if it's not in the air? A landfill? Then it winds up in the water. Or do they separate all the metals out of used oil and recycle those into new products? What happens to the rest of what gets filtered and refined out of it? My assumption is that all that admittedly toxic and awful stuff winds up in the air or the water whether it's burned or re-refined. If that's not accurate, I'll consider doing something else with it if it makes more sense.
You live in the Chicago NW suburbs somewhere, probably not far from me. Maybe I'll bring it to your house and you can do with it what you think is best for the environment. I'd bet it winds up in the same place either way, but I won't call you a fool or suggest you made a stupid decision for it either way.
Again, please educate me rather than berate me. If it makes more sense to do something else with the oil, I will consider that, but there has been no evidence yet that what I'm doing is any better or worse than any of the alternatives. |
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| N_Jay |
quote:
Originally posted by jarizzo
I'm pretty sure a cement plant that burns used oil isn't doing any quality control on the inputs or the outputs, whether they're burning used tires or used oil.
I would bet there are regulations they either have to follow (or bribe the inspectors to ignore)
quote:
Originally posted by jarizzo
The shop that burns my oil might well have a modern, licensed burner.
Maybe, maybe not. Did you ask?
quote:
Originally posted by jarizzo
What kind of restrictions do they have? How do those restrictions change what or when the contaminants wind up in the environment?
Look it up.
The information I found was fairly clear.
quote:
Originally posted by jarizzo
Even if they are scrubbing the combustion gases, that stuff winds up in the landfill anyway right? What else do they do with it? Air or water, where do you want my used oil contaminants to go? Why is one better than the other?
Hopefully those writing the rules and designing the system take all outputs into account. Something I don't think the small burner owner is capable of.
quote:
Originally posted by jarizzo
What else do they do with it? Air or water, where do you want my used oil contaminants to go? Why is one better than the other?
Although not perfect we can usually assume that disposing according to the regulations is better then not.
quote:
Originally posted by jarizzo
It seems like you're suggesting that "controls" and "restrictions" somehow magically remove the contaminants from the environment.
No, it just takes into account more things than most people do when "guessing" on their own.
quote:
Originally posted by jarizzo
Where does the stuff go if it's not in the air? A landfill? Then it winds up in the water. Or do they separate all the metals out of used oil and recycle those into new products? What happens to the rest of what gets filtered and refined out of it? My assumption is that all that admittedly toxic and awful stuff winds up in the air or the water whether it's burned or re-refined. If that's not accurate, I'll consider doing something else with it if it makes more sense.
I would do some research before assuming everything is equal.
quote:
Originally posted by jarizzo
You live in the Chicago NW suburbs somewhere, probably not far from me. Maybe I'll bring it to your house and you can do with it what you think is best for the environment. I'd bet it winds up in the same place either way, but I won't call you a fool or suggest you made a stupid decision for it either way.
Oil disposal is one of the reasons I have mine done at the dealer. (or other regulated shop).
quote:
Originally posted by jarizzo
Again, please educate me rather than berate me. If it makes more sense to do something else with the oil, I will consider that, but there has been no evidence yet that what I'm doing is any better or worse than any of the alternatives.
The evidence is scarce, but a with a little research you may decide to make other choices. |
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| 75blazer |
Here we go. From the horses mouth, or at least from the American Petrolium Institute.
"There are many practical uses for used motor oil. A primary use is to rerefine it into a base stock for lubricating oil. This process is very similar to the refining of crude oil. The result is that the rerefined oil is of as high a quality as a virgin oil product. In fact, rerefining used oil takes from 50 to 85 percent less energy than refining crude oil.
A secondary use of the used oil is to burn it for energy. Large industrial boilers can efficiently burn the used oil with minimum pollution. As a result some used oil is sent to power plants or cement kilns to be burned as fuel. On a smaller scale small quantities of used oil are burned in specially designed heaters to provide space heating for small businesses.
As you can see, recycled used oil probably touches your life every day without you even knowing it. As consumers, we all benefit from recycling used motor oil. From augmenting our oil supplies and helping to generate heat, to protecting the environment, recycling oil just makes good sense."
After reading this I'm calling it a tie. So back to my question, does this guy want my oil to get some free heat? |
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| N_Jay |
quote:
Originally posted by 75blazer
After reading this I'm calling it a tie. So back to my question, does this guy want my oil to get some free heat?
My reading is he is probably NOT ALLOWED to take it to burn.
Of course I am not a lawyer.
Not to be picky about the definition of a "tie", but it seems most of what you found fairly well alignes with what I have been saying, and not well with some of the other views presented.
Of course you may have learned baseball in one of those leagues that did not keep score so "everyone is a winner" !;) ;) |
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| jarizzo |
quote:
Originally posted by 75blazer
I see you're in Chicago, I am too. Where is this place? I'd be happy to help someone get free heat. I've heard that the oil burners you're talking about actually burn quite clean too.
I go to a place out in Woodridge, actually, about 7 miles northeast of where I live. It's on the southwest corner of 75th and Woodward. It's a quick lube type place that's got a weird entrance and it's not real visible from the intersection. I just happened across the place one time out shopping and went in to ask if they would take used oil. He said they burn it and bring in as much as I want. You got yourself a deal there buddy!
About 5 of my friends used to come over to change oil in their multiple vehicles using my garage and tools, and I would accumulate about 30 gallons a year in small buckets. Jiffy Lube used to have to bring out a forklift to pick up all the buckets, but now they only want to take 2 at a time and my friends all have their own garages now so I don't go back there. Three of the AutoZone stores near me used to take it, but now they say their insurance won't let them do it anymore, so they had the used oil tanks removed from the back of the stores. The law here is that oil change places have to take used oil, but a lot of the time they don't do it or they have such restrictions on where, when, and how much that it's not worth the trouble.
I know there are other places that burn it. A buddy of mine works at breakfast cereal plant (better not say the name or somebody might try to start a boycott) and he said they burn the oil they drain from their machinery and the heat actually feeds the machines that cook cereal. Imagine that. They get useful work done from used oil. They also burn sawdust and scraps from a sawmill owned by a friend of one of the plant bosses. If the oil change place won't take my old oil anymore, he said he'll take it to the plant for me as long as I don't have 50 gallons or something like that. I usually only have a couple buckets full, maybe 4 or 5 gallons total, and it takes a while for that much to accumulate. |
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| jarizzo |
quote:
Originally posted by N_Jay
My reading is he is probably NOT ALLOWED to take it to burn.
Of course I am not a lawyer.
Here's what the EPA says on their web site entitled "How Do I Manage My Used Oil And Used Oil Filters:"
Used oil can be burned in oil-fired space heaters if:
* the heater burns only used oil generated on site or from a household “do it yourselfer,”
My reading is it doesn't take a lawyer, but a person who is conscious, able to read English, and who understands the definition of "do it yourselfer" to translate that statement.
Keep trying, though. You'll win the argument and lots of friends sooner or later. |
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| N_Jay |
quote:
Originally posted by jarizzo
Here's what the EPA says on their web site entitled "How Do I Manage My Used Oil And Used Oil Filters:"
Used oil can be burned in oil-fired space heaters if:
* the heater burns only used oil generated on site or from a household “do it yourselfer,”
My reading is it doesn't take a lawyer, but a person who is conscious, able to read English, and who understands the definition of "do it yourselfer" to translate that statement.
Keep trying, though. You'll win the argument and lots of friends sooner or later.
Yes, it does look like there is an exception for do-it-yourself oil to be burnt for space heat by others.
I had been lead to believe that this exception did not exist.
My mistake. |
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| 75blazer |
quote:
Originally posted by jarizzo
I go to a place out in Woodridge, actually, about 7 miles northeast of where I live. It's on the southwest corner of 75th and Woodward. It's a quick lube type place that's got a weird entrance and it's not real visible from the intersection. I just happened across the place one time out shopping and went in to ask if they would take used oil. He said they burn it and bring in as much as I want. You got yourself a deal there buddy!
About 5 of my friends used to come over to change oil in their multiple vehicles using my garage and tools, and I would accumulate about 30 gallons a year in small buckets. Jiffy Lube used to have to bring out a forklift to pick up all the buckets, but now they only want to take 2 at a time and my friends all have their own garages now so I don't go back there. Three of the AutoZone stores near me used to take it, but now they say their insurance won't let them do it anymore, so they had the used oil tanks removed from the back of the stores. The law here is that oil change places have to take used oil, but a lot of the time they don't do it or they have such restrictions on where, when, and how much that it's not worth the trouble.
I know there are other places that burn it. A buddy of mine works at breakfast cereal plant (better not say the name or somebody might try to start a boycott) and he said they burn the oil they drain from their machinery and the heat actually feeds the machines that cook cereal. Imagine that. They get useful work done from used oil. They also burn sawdust and scraps from a sawmill owned by a friend of one of the plant bosses. If the oil change place won't take my old oil anymore, he said he'll take it to the plant for me as long as I don't have 50 gallons or something like that. I usually only have a couple buckets full, maybe 4 or 5 gallons total, and it takes a while for that much to accumulate.
That's only a few miles from my parent's house. I'll have to bring it out that way next time we go out to the burbs. |
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| youbetcha |
quote:
Originally posted by jarizzo
It all depends on what they mean by "recycling." Sometimes, recycling means re-refining the product and selling it as a new product. Sometimes recycling means using the oil in an oil-burning furnace. The furnaces will burn pretty much anything, so places that do that don't care much about what's in there as long as there's no water or antifreeze. If it's going to be re-refined, they're more selective about what gets mixed with what. I take mine to a local mechanic shop that burns the used oil. They don't look at it or smell it or anything. Into the fuel tank it goes and they heat the building almost for free in the winter. With rising energy prices, this may become more common practice. Since I usually have transmission fluid, gear oil, power steering fluid, brake fluid, engine oil, and stale 2-cycle gas all mixed together, it's much easier to find a place that just burns it.
John
:7:
Do they also insulate the place with asbsetos? |
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| 75blazer |
| So after all of this, I finally got around to taking my used fuids over to Murray's for recyling. As it turns out, they do NOT need to be separated as they simply dumped both containers into the same bin. So there you have it. |
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| whizmo |
Most recycling places are Okay with mixing LUBRICANTS, so motor oil, gear oil, and transmission fluid are probably Okay. But I've never heard anyplace that wants solvent, brake fluiid, or antifreeze mixed in. I'd keep these separate.
Most municipalities are running recycling events these days. That's where I get rid of stuff.
- Mark |
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